17Thousand Songs
A podcast where we explore the stories behind our inspired Latter-day Saint hymns to refresh, rekindle, and restore your faith.
17Thousand Songs
"Gethsemane" with Melanie Hoffman: Jesus Loves Me (17KS Ep3)
Join our conversation with Melanie Hoffman, lyricist and songwriter of "Gethsemane," to hear the faith-filled events and personal backstory that led to the creation of a song loved by children (and grown-ups!) worldwide. Hear how her life took a turn when she married her future arranging partner, Roger Hoffman, and how a walk into the creative wilderness (led only by the spirit), an unexpected opportunity to become a songwriter, a personal journey through the Holy Land and the Garden itself, and a sincere desire to create musical works for the Lord, resulted in this simple, yet profoundly doctrinal, children's song about the Savior's Atonement.
Watch the video version of this episode on our YouTube channel.
youtube.com/@17thousandsongs
SHOW NOTES
00:00 – Podcast Intro
00:32 – Welcome
01:42 – Guitar Chords & Art
03:10 – BYU & Meeting Roger
05:39 – Divine Discontent
06:37 – Struggling Financially
07:37 – An Unexpected Opportunity
09:12 – Scripture Scouts
10:07 – Onward to More Projects
11:40 – The Value of Courage
12:55 – Depending Upon Inspiration
15:08 – Stories of Jesus
16:55 – Jesus Loves Me
18:25 – The Bridge
19:35 – The Message & Meaning
20:44 – Kids Need to Know
21:24 – And Grown-ups
22:14 – The Holy Land
23:54 – The Garden Tomb
25:28 – Can I Sing Gethsemane?
26:38 – Takes Off on YouTube
27:42 – Published in The Friend
28:45 – The Review Process
30:37 – Adopted by Other Faiths
32:36 – Now It's Everyone's Song
33:56 – Choose to Be Chosen
35:32 – Gethsemane
36:49 – Podcast Outro
Other Music by Melanie
See other songs written or arranged by Melanie and Roger Hoffman on their website at hoffmanhouse.com
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Disclaimer
17Thousand Songs is not affiliated with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. The views, opinions and thoughts of our host and guests are our own and do not necessarily reflect the views of the Church.
[Podcast Intro]
Alaina Larsen: Welcome to 17Thousand Songs, a podcast where we explore the stories behind our inspired Latter-day Saint hymns to refresh, rekindle, and restore your faith. I'm your host, Alaina Larsen.
[Welcome]
Alaina Larsen: Welcome back to 17Thousand Songs. I'm your host, Alaina Larsen. And in our studio today is Melanie Hoffman, who is the songwriter of Gethsemane. Her husband, Roger Hoffman, is actually the arranger and he is not with us today. He actually chose to have this interview be all about Melanie, which I think is so sweet. He did not want to take your spotlight.
Melanie Hoffman: He is very sweet that way.
Alaina Larsen: He is so adorable. So, he is not with us. We hope he will come back, preferably to speak about "Consider the Lilies," which is a favorite. So, I'm hoping we will have reason to interview him.
Melanie Hoffman: I hope you do too, because it's a wonderful story.
Alaina Larsen: We really want to hear that story. So, I'm hopeful we will see him in another interview. But today it is just Melanie, and we are talking about Gethsemane, which is already a really well-known and loved song. Many Primaries have already sung this in their Primary programs. So, this is definitely not a new song, but it is new to our hymnal, so that's really exciting. And there's a lot to talk about before we even get to Gethsemane, on how you even began songwriting and got into music. So, let's get right in it. Thank you so much for coming.
Melanie Hoffman: Oh, I'm happy to be here.
[Guitar Chords & Art]
Alaina Larsen: I think we should just start with, particularly what got you going on this musical journey. Before we started filming, we talked a little bit about your history, and music wasn't really something you thought you would do. So, can you, can you tell us about that?
Melanie Hoffman: My whole life, I grew up in a little small town and I loved music. Music was in our home. We played the musicals, I danced to the musicals, and really loved it, and was in choir and stuff through high school.
But I, I took piano lessons when I was little and I, I just couldn't, I just couldn't learn to read very well. And I loved to play by ear. And so, my piano teacher taught me guitar chords. Because she saw that I was, it was hopeless for me. So, she actually really, really gave me a wonderful gift because, you know, I've used it the rest of my life.
Alaina Larsen: And that is such a good way to learn in preparation for songwriting.
Melanie Hoffman: Yes, yes. And then I got another piano teacher later and she said, "Oh, if I'd only had you first. If I only could have gotten that out of you!" And it's like, "No, it wouldn't go out." It was just what I was, what I was oriented to. So, I love, always loved it, but I was an artist. I loved to draw and I had identified myself as an artist from the time I was five. That was who I was.
Alaina Larsen: Which is another beautiful skill.
Melanie Hoffman: It is. And it's surprising to me because I, you know, got my degree in art and everything.
[BYU & Meeting Roger]
But my life took a whole different turn when I met my husband, Roger.
I was in my, I think it was in my junior year at BYU, and I was in a choir that was called the University Chorale at the time. It was a 300 voice non-auditioned choir. So, um, I was just one of the many, many, many, many sopranos, and Roger was the Assistant Director for the choir. And I loved it every time we could sing under him because he was just so brilliant and wonderful. And I watched him for a whole semester and totally impressed. And he, he does say, "Well, I, I, I, I read your name and I thought what a musical name, Melanie Mendenhall," you know, so he said, "I saw your name." So, I didn't feel too bad that he didn't notice me in that big choir.
Anyway, the next year, I was with my roommates, we had to find a new place to live. And we walked past these moon apartments. And I said, "Why don't we try there?" And they said, "Okay," and they didn't really care. But obviously, it was an important thing for me to go there because Roger was in that ward. So, I saw him again. And again, didn't really think about him. As he was actually kind of a ladies man. The ladies really liked him. He tells me that he didn't really know that he was like that, but girls really, really liked him.
So, I really didn't think about him at all. But towards the end of that time period, I had given a talk in Sunday School. And he was the Sunday School President. He came up to me afterwards to, you know, tell me how well I'd done and everything. And he says that he looked into my eyes and he was just, "I have to know her, have to know her better." He actually wrote a song for me about that, um, for our 25th anniversary. It's the most beautiful love song that no one's ever heard but me.
Alaina Larsen: Oh, that's adorable.
Melanie Hoffman: It's really sweet. So, we did end up together. And when we got married, he was in a dance band, and he was singing backups for Donny and Marie. And he got the opportunity to work at BYU Motion Picture Studios as a composer and then they would teach him how to be a recording engineer. So, he took that job and it was a really good opportunity. He learned a lot. And I finished my degree just before I had our first baby. And so, then we moved to a new house.
[Divine Discontent]
And we were there for maybe a couple of years, not, not too long. And then we started to feel like we were in the wrong place. Both of us, it was just like, this is a good place. We have, good health insurance, we have job security, we have all this stuff. And neither one of us felt like we were doing the right thing. Felt like we needed to be, well, doing music for the Lord.
Alaina Larsen: Okay, question. So, when you got this prompting, you know, we need to be doing this. Did you feel like, "Yeah, Roger should be doing this?" Or had you kind of imagined, "I would be helping" or "I would be a part of that."
Melanie Hoffman: I didn't know except I had such a desire to do something for the world, to do something for children. My dream had always been to write and illustrate a children's book. That was my goal, because I, I've always been oriented to children. But no. I didn't do anything with the music, and I didn't do anything with the art either. There were just, I just was kind of like, "Okay, here we go!" We're just going to be going out and seeing what's going to happen.
[Struggling Financially]
And we moved from the one place that we were living up into a new area by Provo Temple. And it was a wonderful, wonderful ward. We were struggling financially. It was very, very difficult. And we had kind of moved into an older ward, so it was like a ward of grandpas and grandmas. And they just, they loved us. And they, I think they were kind of like, "What are they thinking?" You know? "What are you doing?" I mean, we did get that, you know. "Are you sure you don't need a day job?" "We really do feel like we're supposed to be doing this."
And anyway, we would get help from them. They anonymously would just put money in Roger's pocket at church and he'd come home and there it was. Anyway, we had great support. So, that is how actually Roger wrote "Consider the Lilies" is he wanted to write about how the Lord would take care of you if you trusted him and did what he wants you to do. So, but I'll leave that story for him for some time.
[An Unexpected Opportunity]
Anyway so, we were doing it for a couple of years and we were involved with people that were in music publishing. We had friends, Roger was working with Janice Perry. He produced her, uh, several of her albums and was a vocalist for her. And Marvin Payne was one of our dear friends. And we had other people that were in that field. And so a friend of ours, who was a publisher, he owned, uh, Sonos Music Publishing at the time. And he really wanted to make a project for children about the Book of Mormon. And he was telling us about that, and I just thought, "Well, that sounds like a really fun thing."
And, one day I was just washing dishes, which is pretty much where I always get inspiration, cutting hair, washing dishes, driving the kids to wherever they needed to go. And this song just popped into my head, you know, it was, "You gotta go leave Jerusalem, you gotta go to the wilderness." So, I, I called Larry and I said, "Larry, listen to this."
And so I sang it, and this is not, was not me at all, but I just thought, "Ah well, I'll let him hear it, and he can have that idea." He said, "Oh, great. You can write the songs!" And I was just like, "What?!"
Alaina Larsen: That's amazing that he just gave you that opportunity.
Melanie Hoffman: Yes. Yeah. Oh.
Alaina Larsen: And that he believed in you...
Melanie Hoffman: Yes!
Alaina Larsen: ...that you could do that.
Melanie Hoffman: And well, he was a very, very inspired man. He just, I don't know. He really did. I didn't have that confidence. I just thought, "What are you talking about?" But he was just insistent that, "Yeah, you can do this!" And Marvin Payne was going to write the dialogue.
[Scripture Scouts]
And so, Marvin and Roger and I would meet together. They'd always come to my house. For all the years we worked together. They always came to my house because I was the mom. And I said, "I can't...
Alaina Larsen: Oh, that's so sweet.
Melanie Hoffman: ...I can't leave my kids." And they said, "Okay." So, we had kids running in and, you know, just mayhem.
Alaina Larsen: I love that they, they made that accessible to you, to be a part of the project.
Melanie Hoffman: Yes, they were, they were very good about that. So, I ended up writing fifty-something songs for... it's called Scripture Scouts, Book of Mormon.
Alaina Larsen: Yes, that's right! And we were talking before we started filming that my brother-in-law was Skylar in the Scripture Scouts.
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah, that was a really fun connection to make because I haven't, I haven't seen John for years.
Alaina Larsen: Yes. He was very energetic.
Melanie Hoffman: Yes.
Alaina Larsen: And still is, actually, I would say. So, yeah, he did a good job in that.
Melanie Hoffman: It was a fun project. So, that really is what started my writing, and Roger and I working together.
[Onward to More Projects]
We decided to do another one, so I, uh, wrote an album called, “Happy, Happy, Joy, Joy, Joy.” And Roger produced it and arranged and we, ya know, worked on it together. And our children sang on it, which is very fun.
Alaina Larsen: Oh, how fun.
Melanie Hoffman: Very, very fun. And then we did an “All About” series with Marvin Payne and Steve Perry. We have a group called Peace Mountain Media Works, and that's the four of us. And we have done a lot of projects.
We did a big project for Richard and Linda Eyre. They were Scripture Scout fans and asked us to write a series for them.
And it was really fun because it would turn out to be an adventure series and we were doing values. I have to say that. I, I just prayed like crazy because I didn't know what I was doing. And every six weeks we put out a new one and there were 12 of them.
Alaina Larsen: That is quick. That is really quick.
Melanie Hoffman: It's insane.
Alaina Larsen: So, was this scriptural content or religious content or something totally different?
Melanie Hoffman: No, this was for, just values for children. So it was a wonderful, wonderful opportunity.
Alaina Larsen: So, uplifting content, but not necessarily Christian or religious.
Melanie Hoffman: Right, right. So, every six weeks we would do like, honesty, courage, I mean, all of these values. And Steve and I were the songwriters. He would write the hit song every, every time. At the end of the series, they would, they would wrap it up with this contemporary song. They, they were beautiful. He's a brilliant, brilliant writer. So, we divided the, the songwriting, you know, job up every, so we were doing that every six weeks.
[The Value of Courage]
And we were into our second one, and I had also been called as Young women President.
Alaina Larsen: That is a lot to take on.
Melanie Hoffman: It is a lot and we were new in the ward. So, I was feeling pretty overwhelmed, and I was also feeling kind of intimidated because, I don't know, I just felt like, I don't, I don't know that I can do this. Because it was a whole different set-up and a different style than Scripture Scouts had been.
So, one day I was walking and praying and just saying, "I, I. don't think I can do this." Interestingly enough, the value was courage. And I was writing a, I was supposed to write a song about courage, and I was just frightened. I just thought, "I just don't think I can do it. I can't do it all."
And, and I remember exactly where I was in the neighborhood. I got this, just the strongest, strongest impression. And it was like, "Don't ever doubt your value in this team again. Don't ever. You can do this." And then here comes this chorus, "You are stronger than fear. You are brighter than doubt. You have courage inside. You just have to let it out." So, that was a really beautiful experience for me. And then we went on and, you know, finished, finished it in another year and a half.
[Depending Upon Inspiration]
Alaina Larsen: Well, what I love about that is that advice was really not even just your advice in the song itself, right? That's advice coming through the spirit, from God, you know, "This is how you should feel about courage." And I think that's one thing that just makes your songs so beautiful. I mean, I know Scripture Scouts are totally beloved by obviously my in-laws. And not only was my brother-in-law in it, but they love those songs, and they're so well written.
So, to hear you say how this was such a new skill, how you had to pray every day. I mean, how wonderful because being new at something forced you to turn to the Lord and then you were able to receive so much more inspiration. And I think that's one reason why your songs are the kind of messages people really need to hear and just awesome songs, because it really shows it's coming from the Lord, not just, you know, from you.
Melanie Hoffman: Well, I have said this many times, I could not do it. I could not do it. And I, if I've, I've tried before, you know, if it's not the right time and I'm, I, I totally have to depend on inspiration.
Alaina Larsen: So, have you loved that process or is it also scary that you're so reliant? I mean, I guess I'm saying like, sometimes do you kind of wish, I just, I wish I had these amazing skills and I didn't need to rely or have you loved that? Just tell me about that.
Melanie Hoffman: I have, I have loved it because, it has forged such a relationship. Because I've just been, I feel like I've been in deep water the whole time writing, you know, cause everything that came was a different style or a different, you know, different thing that had to happen.
And, and I didn't know what I was doing, you know, I just, and so I, I feel like it's been a really beautiful thing. I think it's the thing that has made me who I am today. All those years of just, you know, petitioning the Lord for help and, and hearing and receiving songs that have helped my life, you know. I've totally been blessed by the songs, so...
Alaina Larsen: So, even with, I mean, how many songs have you written total? Isn't it close to 200?
Melanie Hoffman: It is. We counted it's about 170.
Alaina Larsen: Oh, my goodness! So, even with all those, you still have felt all along you needed the Lord every time?
Melanie Hoffman: Oh yeah. Oh yeah!
[Stories of Jesus]
Alaina Larsen: So, in all of these different series that you were writing, you did, what, seven, a dozen different series that each had many songs in each series, and it was in one of those series that you ended up writing Gethsemane, right? Isn't that how Gethsemane came about?
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah, actually, it was in a collection of songs that I actually didn't do with the, the team. It was one that I did by myself. Over the years, I've written so many songs about the Savior from the different projects, you know, different aspects of faith or whatever in the storyline or in the scripture storyline. But, I really, really wanted to do something about the life of the Savior. And I loved, I loved Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat. And I thought, "It's so fun. Couldn't, could we do something that was kind of fun and wonderful about the Savior for children?"
And we had a friend who was a really wonderful man, sweet man, and I approached him about it and said, "You know, this is what I want to do," and he had helped us do a project the year before, Lullabies of Jesus. And he said, "Oh, I think. I think we'll just pass on this one as an investor." And he went home and talked to his wife and she said, "No, no, we are doing this album."
So, um, I started writing and it goes from his birth to his resurrection. So, there's 15 songs and I started just delving into the New Testament. It was so wonderful. It was the, it was the most wonderful experience I've ever had is writing these songs because I just poured over the scriptures. And I wanted to make sure that anything I said in the song was something that the Savior actually said. So, I had this little hard thing that I had to do, but I was glad that I did it.
[Jesus Loves Me]
So, anyway, I was really worried about what I was going to do about his suffering, the Atonement, because this was designed for little children. And I thought, "Well, maybe I'll use There is a Green Hill Far Away. Because I love that song, and it was actually written for children.
Alaina Larsen: Right, right.
Melanie Hoffman: And one day we were up in the canyon, up in Big Springs, beautiful, up in Provo Canyon. And we love to go up there to write and just think and get inspiration. And I had been working on Loaves and Fishes, which was just, it was such a hard song to write, to get everything perfect and get all the details and make it fun and everything. Anyway, it had turned out really well and I, we'd just finished it, I'd shown it to Roger, and then we were coming back from that session. And I know exactly where I was in the canyon. So, we just, we were driving home and all of a sudden the words just came into my mind, "Gethsemane, Jesus loves me." And I was just like, I mean, it really truly hit me like a thunderbolt. I said, "Roger, there is a song! There is a song!"
And I was so excited! And we got home and I just ran and sat down at the kitchen table and got the scriptures out and, um, just started writing, just kind of telling the story. As you know, as a songwriter, very seldom does something just roll out and it's perfect, ya know. But this one, this one did. It came together so fast.
[The Bridge]
And then it got to the part, the bridge part, where, um, "The hardest thing that ever was done. The greatest pain that ever was known." I was just, it was so simple. And I thought, "A little child can understand this. I can understand it." Finally, I have a grasp on the Atonement, because of this song.
Alaina Larsen: And it is such an easy, that bridge in particular, is so easy to sing and so exciting to sing. And the kids love to sing that, ya know?
Melanie Hoffman: They do. And I love it when I watch children sing because they'll, they get, they get louder and louder and louder and nobody is, they're not, the leaders aren't doing it.
Alaina Larsen: It's so true.
Melanie Hoffman: And then they just go... down, just naturally they go back down into the last part.
Alaina Larsen: I have actually heard, you know, now that these, um, children's songs could be sung in sacrament, people are like, "Well, what are we going to do with that bridge? Because everyone's just going to be excited and shouting, 'this was done by Jesus!'" And I just keep thinking, "Well, I think we could use a little more excitement in our singing in sacrament!"
Melanie Hoffman: I think we could be as excited about Jesus as we can be, you know? I, I think it's really, I'm really excited and grateful that it came.
[The Message & Meaning]
Alaina Larsen: And, and I think, too, the inspiration that you got, because there's really any line that I feel like the Spirit could have inspired you with, right? Like the bridge, or it could have been... But it was specifically that chorus of "Gethsemane, Jesus loves me."
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah.
Alaina Larsen: Which really colors the whole song, you know?
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah, that's the message.
Alaina Larsen: That's the meaning is that he did it because he loved us.
Melanie Hoffman: And one thing that's interesting is, at the end, it changes. "Gethsemane, Jesus loves me. So he gave his gift to me in Gethsemane." And then it changes again, "Gethsemane, Jesus loves me. So, he gives his gift to me from Gethsemane." Well, as a songwriter, I mean, you don't change the chorus, you know? You just want to keep doing it. But I felt very strongly about that. Because it takes it from it happened then and it brings it right up to today. It's like, "He gives it to me now. It's mine to take now, but I have to receive it."
Alaina Larsen: That's so beautiful because it is so important that we understand that it's something that we can actually get a hold of each day rather than just it happening in the past.
[Kids Need to Know]
Melanie Hoffman: A grandmother wrote to us and told us about her little grandson who was being bullied at school. And during the recess, he would go somewhere and, and sing Gethsemane just to get strength. Because it says, "He felt all it was sad, wicked or bad." Children can understand those concepts like, "Oh yeah, and I can go to him for help because he understands." Children need to know about the Atonement. They need to understand, because they need to access it. This is not an easy world to live in. So, the more understanding that they have of the power that is available to them, the better they can deal with it.
[And Grown-ups]
And grown-ups. I had a dear friend who passed away from COVID. Uh, but she'd had a really, really difficult life. Just, I've never met anyone had such a hard life. And she told me that she sang Gethsemane to herself every night as she laid in bed to get comfort.
I didn't know all this. I didn't understand. I don't know when I started learning about the fact that the atonement was for all our pain, and all our sorrow. I grew up, it was, you know, the Atonement was for all bad stuff you do, you know. But, it's so much more. I mean, it's infinitely more than that. And that's what I think is beautiful, is that now children are starting to understand that from how they're being taught in church and at home.
Alaina Larsen: And with simple truths that are easy to remember through song.
[The Holy Land]
Melanie Hoffman: One thing about this, Roger and I had the opportunity to go to the Holy Land ten years before I had written this. And we went and Roger was singing the part of the Savior in The Garden. I don't know if you know that. That's an older thing that, um, Mike McLean and Bryce Newbert wrote, and it's beautiful. And we had the opportunity to go over there and they sang it in the Jerusalem Center. And it was just a really neat thing, but we also toured for ten days.
Alaina Larsen: What a lovely experience.
Melanie Hoffman: Oh, it was. And I tried to prepare for it before, I thought, "What should I do? What should I read?" you know, I just thought, "Am I just going to be like solemn the whole time we're just going to be walking, you know, how is it going to feel?" And as we touched down, on Israeli soil when we were landing, I was overcome with this joy. And it was, it was like the Savior was saying, "I did it. It's done. It's your gift. Now take it." And it was so incredible. It was such a beautiful experience. And then, you know, ten years later, comes this song. And I had walked up the hill in our final tour as we were going to Gethsemane and you do walk up the hill and it gets harder and harder because it gets steeper and steeper. And so all those images, you know, I just felt like I was meant to write this, this project. And the Lord had given me all those beautiful opportunities.
Alaina Larsen: Yeah, to have you walk that path that he walked, you would instinctively visually go through that as you're writing the song, and that is what's in those lyrics, that he walked up that hill.
[The Garden Tomb]
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah. So, and then when you go on a tour of the Holy Land, and Usually the last week of his life, they make it the last day of your tour. And so the last day we went to all the different stations, and different places that things had happened. We went to the Garden of Gethsemane and then to the Upper Room and all those places.
Anyway, we ended up at the Garden Tomb. And so just like us, everybody else does the same thing. So, it was so crowded. We walked in and there were just so many people. And as we were standing there, we just were, I was amazed that there were all these people singing, all these little groups of people singing different songs to the Savior. I mean, it was so beautiful. All of those voices from all the different languages, all of the different melodies. But it was this beautiful cacophony of joy and praise to Jesus. It was really beautiful.
Alaina Larsen: And it's kind of interesting to me that, you know, someone could have just been standing there giving a speech or a talk or, you know, and everyone could be listening. But the fact that everyone chose to sing.
Melanie Hoffman: Sing!
Alaina Larsen: That singing seemed the most appropriate way to say thank you for what you've done is, yeah, that's really beautiful.
Melanie Hoffman: Well, and the last thing that the Savior did with his apostles, before they left for Gethsemane, they sang a hymn. I think that's really significant that they sang together. Music is power.
[Can I Sing Gethsemane?]
So, after I was finished with it, I, I was just, I mean, I was in tears. I was like, "Wow, this is so wonderful!" And we had children lined up to sing all these songs, as we finished the album. Every one of them said, "Can I sing Gethsemane? Can I sing Gethsemane?" I thought, "Okay, this is, this is working. This is going to work."
Alaina Larsen: Can, can I just say that surprises me too, right? That you would not think that a child of all the songs about the Savior's life that they would want to sing about his suffering in Gethsemane, right?
Melanie Hoffman: I know!
Alaina Larsen: I mean, like you said, it was the one that you were most fearful of writing, and it would make sense to me that it's the one that they would have the least interest in singing. But it became the one that they love the most.
Melanie Hoffman: I think it's because they, they, they know it. They came knowing the Savior. They know what he did. And this song helps them articulate that, and to express how they feel about him and what he feels about them. So, I was extremely grateful that the Lord would send it to me because it just made, it made the whole project complete.
[Takes Off on YouTube]
So, it really didn't take off at all. It was just kind of buried somewhere, um, in the album. And I actually submitted it to the Church for their contest and didn't win.
Alaina Larsen: So, the initial time you submitted it to the Church, they didn't take it?
Melanie Hoffman: No, no. Well, I mean, I think it got an Honorable Mention. And I thought, "I know this song is important. I really know it is." And it was submitted to something else, and it didn't get, you know, selected or anything. And I thought, "Okay."
And then Jenny Phillips actually asked us if she could record it and then she put it out and it started to get some attention. Some other people in, I think it was in Oregon, for an institute, they did a slideshow with it and it went crazy on YouTube.
Alaina Larsen: And then Claire Crosby...
Melanie Hoffman: And then Claire, they made that beautiful video. And her dad said she came to him and said, "I want to sing this song." She was three and a half. And then other kids started making videos.
[Published in The Friend]
And I don't know really how it got into the Primary using it, but it started to just kind of get around. And I guess it was 2016, the Church asked if they could publish it in The Friend. So, they did a, I think it's called, "I Can Play It." It's a real simplified version. So, they did a simplified version of Gethsemane and it came out then.
Alaina Larsen: So, it didn't actually end up in The Friend because you submitted it through a formal Church contest. It was just on the CD, other people were finding the CD, now it was getting pretty popular, other people were singing it, and then the Church came to you and said, "We want it now."
Melanie Hoffman: Joy Jones said to me, "We go all over and this is the children's favorite Primary song and it's not a Primary song. Can we get it into The Friend so it can be used in the Primaries?”
Alaina Larsen: Well, it’s clear the people called for this song, right? And in particular, the children—the children called for this song. The children love this song.
Melanie Hoffman: Well, I was, I was really happy.
[The Review Process]
Alaina Larsen: So, after they let you know that they wanted this song and that it was going to be in the hymnal, was there a review process? Did they have changes, uh, that they wanted to make?
Melanie Hoffman: There was a review of the music and the arrangement and the lyrics. It really isn't a normal format, you know?
Alaina Larsen: Right. And they had to really figure out how they were going to structure that...
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah.
Alaina Larsen: ...in, you know, making that as short as possible for it to be able to be put in the hymnal. But I love that they didn't take that hurdle and say, "Oh, we're not going to put it in just because it's a different structure." The structure is something that people love. And so, I'm glad they made that work.
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah. Brother Jones is the one that worked with us on the format so it could fit. And he called up and he said, "Okay. Is it okay if we cut the intro and the ending, because it will save like a million pages if you do this." And I'm like, "That's fine, that's just fine." So, I was amazed that they got down to two pages too.
Alaina Larsen: Yeah, yeah, that is really impressive. But there are some things that they couldn't just overlap, because it, like you say, it does change, or those lyrics, that really important, um, part in the chorus does change, and I'm glad that they were able to keep that.
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah. And they did have some suggestions of things that they thought might improve the lyrics. But I felt pretty strongly that the words that were there were very simple to understand. And I felt that, uh, well, it was given to me. The song was truly given to me. Also, it's well known to many children. They already knew it. And this was their song. It was sent for children. I love to hear grown-ups sing it. But I love to hear children sing it because they, they love it and it's theirs.
Alaina Larsen: I think if there was even a few words changed in there, you would probably still have a lot of kids singing the original lyrics anyway, right? So...
Melanie Hoffman: Maybe.
Alaina Larsen: I think that was probably a good choice.
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah, they were very good about it.
[Adopted By Other Faiths]
Alaina Larsen: I also want to say, you know, this song for sure is very beloved by our children, and definitely I think the children of our church was saying, "Hey, we want this song." Um, but even people outside of our faith, have come to know this song and sing it at other churches, right? Can you tell us about that?
Melanie Hoffman: That has been the most exciting thing for me is I, I've always dreamed of getting out into the world my testimony of, you know, giving the joy of Jesus, the good news! I've always wanted to, to do that and it's not easy to get out into the world. And somehow, I don't, I really don't know how it happened, I think it's just the Lord's hand, that people from other churches started picking up on it and we started seeing things on YouTube. "It's like, wait, what's this one?" You know? And a parish in Ireland, "We're doing it for our Easter thing." And, and we've had so many different, different religions that have said that they, they just love it, you know?
And during the pandemic, I love this one, a woman wrote to us and she's from the Faroe Islands. They're outside of like off of the coast of England.
Alaina Larsen: Oh, wow.
Melanie Hoffman: And they speak Faroese. I've never heard of it.
Alaina Larsen: Oh my goodness.
Melanie Hoffman: But she said, "I love this song and I want to give this song to our island. And can, do I have permission to, to translate it?" And we're going, "Yes, that is so wonderful!"
Alaina Larsen: Oh, wow.
Melanie Hoffman: It is a dynamite video, dynamite performance. She has a gorgeous voice, and they did this beautiful arrangement. It was so wonderful. And she did it because she wanted to give the people of her island some hope.
Alaina Larsen: I love that. I love that it's a catalyst for other people being able to then take part in sharing their testimony, right?
Melanie Hoffman: Yes.
Alaina Larsen: And like you said, you wanted to get your testimony out there, but now others are able to get their testimony out there through your song by singing it and putting it up on YouTube or making a performance of it and I, I love that.
Melanie Hoffman: Yeah, I do, too.
[Now It’s Everyone’s Song]
Alaina Larsen: Is there anything you want to say about when they they let you know when this song was going to be in the hymnal?
Melanie Hoffman: In May, the night before they released the thirteen songs, they, um, called me and he said, "So, it's going out in the first batch." And I was like, "Really?" And he said, "Yes! And I wanted to be the one to tell you!" He was such a nice guy. The next day I wrote to Jan Pinborough, who's the one that was working with me. She's the editor of The Friend. And she said, "The thing that thrills me the most is that now people all over the church everywhere have access to this song."
And you know, you kind of think, "Well, we hear it here." We think, "Oh, everybody knows it." But we just got a text just like yesterday. They were somewhere in, in South America, I think, it was Bolivia. It said, "The, the people here are loving this song. They've never heard it before."
Alaina Larsen: Right.
Melanie Hoffman: They'd never heard it and they were just loving it. And then my friend who's serving in Africa sent me a picture of all these cute little children surrounding the piano she says, "They're singing your song!
Alaina Larsen: Oh, that's beautiful.
Melanie Hoffman: So, to me, I just think, "Wow." That's something I could never have done. It is such an honor for them to put it in the hymn book, but the most wonderful thing is that it makes it accessible to people who don't have access that now they do. She says, "Now it's everyone's song!"
Alaina Larsen: Oh, that's wonderful.
[Choose to Be Chosen]
Well Melanie, this has been such a fun conversation, and I'm so glad we got to talk about this wonderful song and your beautiful contribution. I just want to end with a couple questions, and it's a two-part question. And that is, "Why do you think the Lord chose you to be the one to contribute this song? And what do you think is going to be the impact on our worldwide church now that it is going to be in our hymnal?"
Melanie Hoffman: Um, I think he sent it because there was a need. The world needs comfort. They need to understand his deep and abiding love. And a long time ago, we, we said, you choose to be chosen. And Roger and I've kind of tried to do that our whole, our whole 40-year career of writing. And so I think because I was in the scriptures, trying to tell the stories of his life that, I was seeking it, and it came.
Alaina Larsen: And I think maybe that's why there was so many songs submitted because there were so many who were willing ...
Melanie Hoffman: Yes.
Alaina Larsen: ...to be a vessel, and he said, "Okay, if you want to be then, then here's a song for you."
Melanie Hoffman: And the Lord needs many voices, you know? That's the thing. And he got them, 17,000 is quite a few voices!
Alaina Larsen: Yeah, definitely. Well, I love that this song came to you. I love your story. I love your testimony. Thank you so much for sharing it with us.
Melanie Hoffman: Well, thank you. And thank you for doing this. I think it's a wonderful thing.
Alaina Larsen: Well, thank you so much for coming in.
[Gethsemane]
Jesus climbed the hill to the garden still. His steps were heavy and slow. Love and a prayer took Him there, to the place only He could go. Gethsemane, Jesus loves me! So, he went willingly to Gethsemane. The hardest thing that ever was done. The greatest pain that ever was known. The biggest battle that ever was won. This was done by Jesus! The fight was won by Jesus! Gethsemane …
[Podcast Outro]